Forex
Google

Go Back   Forex Trading > Non Related Discussions
Forex Forum Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Register in Forex TSD!
Trading Systems Leaders in this forum (automated trading systems) are winning more than 3000 pips in a month (30000$ investing one lot every time).
Click here to register and get more information

Reply
 
LinkBack (1) Thread Tools Display Modes
  1 links from elsewhere to this Post. Click to view. #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2007, 01:21 AM
jjk2 jjk2 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 183
jjk2 is on a distinguished road
Unhappy the downfall of trading systems.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

do TAKE offense if you fall under the scammer category.

without a doubt, there are very good systems on this forum. just like many other communities. But i feel like we are constantly being bombarded with "XXX's 50000 pips a month" or "XOXO's awesome scalping system" and other short lived pathetic systems that are just simply hype basing on backtesting or just a couple months of "trading on metatrader." Quantity is probably what all forums care about, and quality is being eroded by noise and sensleess threads. most forums are being infested with quantity over quality.

heres a brief life cycle:

1) always starts with a fnacy title or itro. "i made XXXX pips in a month"
2) then the setup, and rules
3) ppl start reading
4) ppl think backtest and a couple month of demo trading works awesome. or even a couple months of live trade. ie. "does this indicator repaint" "ZOMG ty."
5) new "extreme loyalists" start backslashing at anyone who criticisezes or fills the critic's PM box with hateful and emtion filled rebuttal about why anyone against the system is a fool, and that they hope that he/she loses money.
6) thread view and posts start picking up. gold stars start piling up, furthering the momentum.
7) "extreme loyalists" and author continues to post and gathers momentum.
8) websites are formed. private groups are created. where you can have access to exclusive information for monthly subscrption.
9) systems are found on eBAY with different names in the form of EAs.
10) new pile of craps push this system to further backpages.

I think anyone proposing a new system should have some restrictions before they post it.

Some questions to ask themselves:

do I stilll trade with this method LIVE (anyone can paint the past) or am I just looking for attention by luring noobs about quick painless profits?
do I believe in this system and think that it will truly contribute to the quality of the overall knowledge of the community.
how long have i been trading system and is it consistent enough and worthy enough to be read by others?
i wonder how many system threads we will have after those filters are enforced.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2007, 04:05 AM
Dave137 Dave137 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 165
Dave137 is on a distinguished road
Smile

Unfortunately, about 98% of all indicators in existence repaint the history. Live forward testing over at least 3 to 6 months gives you an idea as to the ea's possible reliability.

Most people peddling ea's want the money right away and sometimes get it by using backtesting results because buyers are not educated as to what to look for in an ea. Backtesting just gives you a very rough idea as to whether the ea may generate money, and that is only if the modeling quality is 90% or more.

I personally do not like a manual system because it also involves emotions when placing trades plus I have to stay up nights to play the best times (Located in U.S.) EA is still the way to go, but one must be committed to patience and somewhat scientific testing and modifications to reach a point of optimized settings in an EA.

Dave
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2007, 04:38 AM
derikb derikb is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 47
derikb is on a distinguished road
Agree

Hi jjk2,

I've started to return every course, ebook etc that offers a money back guarantee. I buy everything that looks good and there is so many available but if I test it and it doesn't work I just return it. I only buy stuff from clickbank because you just click on yor order and choose return product. Paypal doesn't work because the person that must honour the guarantee have to authorise it. They usually don't but your bank can help you to reverse the transaction. Nobody steal money from me......

I don't think you can buy anything worthwhile.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2007, 11:04 PM
ajk's Avatar
ajk ajk is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 211
ajk is on a distinguished road
eas systems

Most ea's don't work well because the market has different retracments
which "schew" the averages so a system now doesnt work for something else a few weeks later.
really, when you get down to it , there are probably few signals that can get you the exact market "where its @" . The market is also very "visual" ..ie did you see that trend line break? now its support etc..
Backtesting and optimizing cant catch it. so the cycle continues. Most lose in trading , because quit honestly...its darn hard to automate and manual you need to have steel and patients at the same time in your blood.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2007, 12:35 AM
Fulltime247's Avatar
Fulltime247 Fulltime247 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 44
Fulltime247 is on a distinguished road
MOST EA's dont work but SOME do. the ones that do are probably with their owners (programmers) because it really takes a LOT of tweaking to get something that works for a while. After ridiculous periods of tweaking you can finally have a program that can play in most market conditions. (My EA just needs me to pick decent entries for it and it will collect profits until the market turns against me)
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2007, 12:55 AM
prasxz prasxz is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,044
prasxz is on a distinguished road
hi

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajk View Post
Most ea's don't work well because the market has different retracments
which "schew" the averages so a system now doesnt work for something else a few weeks later.
really, when you get down to it , there are probably few signals that can get you the exact market "where its @" . The market is also very "visual" ..ie did you see that trend line break? now its support etc..
Backtesting and optimizing cant catch it. so the cycle continues. Most lose in trading , because quit honestly...its darn hard to automate and manual you need to have steel and patients at the same time in your blood.
That's right ....don't believe backtesting result ...the most important is forward testing for couple months ...we can grow our equity if we know where's the direction of the trend ....not how many pips did u got a day

===================
Forex Indicators Collection
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2007, 02:21 AM
jjk2 jjk2 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 183
jjk2 is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulltime247 View Post
MOST EA's dont work but SOME do. the ones that do are probably with their owners (programmers) because it really takes a LOT of tweaking to get something that works for a while. After ridiculous periods of tweaking you can finally have a program that can play in most market conditions. (My EA just needs me to pick decent entries for it and it will collect profits until the market turns against me)
most definitely. there are some very successful EAs.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2007, 06:09 AM
matfx's Avatar
matfx matfx is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 283
matfx is on a distinguished road
Thumbs up Agree

It happens everywhere (not just in forex-tsd comunity). For the newbies they will easily fall into this kind of promises and astonishing words. Not just "i made xxxx pips per month", some said " how i made xxxx money in a month".

Last edited by matfx : 12-02-2007 at 06:11 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Forum Jump

LinkBacks (?)
LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.forex-tsd.com/non-related-discussions/11021-downfall-trading-systems.html
Posted By For Type Date
BuildHome » the downfall of trading systems. This thread Pingback 12-01-2007 04:09 AM

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
D'Alembert-Based Trading Systems WNW Suggestions for Trading Systems 40 11-21-2007 04:02 PM
DayImpuls indicators (for Zigzag Trading Systems) newdigital Indicators - Metatrader 4 12 10-07-2007 09:41 AM
Improving trading systems... traderdavid Metatrader 4 1 04-28-2007 09:51 AM
Systems Combination Trading System (SCTM) - Lesser whipsaw dit Suggestions for Trading Systems 29 02-16-2007 05:19 AM
Any Dow / SPX systems ? leeb Expert Advisors - Metatrader 4 2 12-05-2006 09:28 AM


All times are GMT. The time now is 01:24 PM.