Programing skils for sale. - Page 20

el cid · #**191** (**permalink**) 10-06-2007, 08:51 PM

I spoke to a member of this forum before hiring programmers and He sent me the following P M

Here is the first P M I received

Greetings. I don't normally frequent forums since I find most of the participants are people looking for a free handout and have nothing to offer. I came here a few months back looking for an experienced programmer and boy was I disappointed!

Here is the second P M I received

Be careful whom you chose from here for programming.

You already know my viewpoint and the majority are thieves and being a programmer is their way of gaining a system that works.

1) For what little it's worth Internationally, if the programmer does not offer to sign a NDA (Non Disclosure Agreement) before you suggest it, then don't even consider using him.

2) When you do get a NDA, ensure it does not have a time expiry clause.

3) If you want, let me know whom you chose before going with them. I don't want to mention the name if I dont have to but despite my NDA (which was iron clad), a programmer whom was supposed to be one of the best on this forum stole my already built EA software (from previous programmer) and all new designs. If you inform me the name, I will let you know if it's the programmer.

Personally I have many system designs that are too important to share but nowhere near the time to begin learning mql4 code. In the end I found a C++ high end programmer very close to me WHOM DOES NOT TRADE and he very quickly adapted to mql4. I suggest you perhaps consider doing same.

Otherwise, I hear (but cannot guarantee at all) that usernames Codersguru and Igorad are very good reliable programmers whom keep to themselves. They are private traders whom have their own systems so really have no interest in stealing yours.

Hope this helps

el cid · #**192** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codersguru

Why don't we make something like RentACoder but for MQL4. Something Like RentAMQL4Coder??

Who want to work with me in such project?

Me but give me some time because I am busy setting up my own automated trading and working on 10 EAS .

When my website is completed it will offer a similiar service ,bring together buyers and sellers of automated programming services as follows

Shield-systems technology company

We consider our customer’s intellectual property as the most confidential information whereas other coders want to take customer's intellectual property and own the copyrights

Regards

El Cid

michal · #**193** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent Mack

I think we're looking at this from different angles - but I really don't understand your position and why it seems so complicated.

So while I may have it wrong - for all practical purposes - I think I have it right.

When a trader contracts with you to code their "special recipe" of indicators or whatever - why do you believe that YOU would be entitled to anything beyond the coding fee and personal access to the EA?

It seems to me that it's very similar to asking you to translate a book that we wrote into a foreign language. We pay you a fee to do that. And that's the end of the story. It's our book, not yours.

Your task isn't to invent the foreign language. That already exists. It's simply to translate OUR work into that existing foreign language.

Now I understand that you've got a software company and everything going on - but as this thread surely demonstrates - we're in a global economy and I don't believe that your business model is going to allow you to be very competitive in this line of work, coding EA's.

There's a million analogies that apply to this situation. For example, if we record a song in your recording studio, it's still OUR song. But apparently with your business model, you intend to sell our "music" and cut us out of the loop?

We as traders are the artists here. You're merely providing a technical function that's, frankly, rather common. Although you do want to latch onto a good source when you find one.

Having said all that - it just goes to show once again that Optimu has demonstrated that he can easily, efficiently and cost-effectively meet the needs of probably 9 out of every 10 people wanting their EA coded.

Just don't crowd me out of his schedule please!

The code is copyrighted by me because 90% of it is developed by me and contains years of experience trading automatically with MT4. Most of my clients thinks only on entry/exit rules forgetting that there is much more to be done to get a robust trading robot. I don't allow my solutions to be copied by others. Keeping code copyrights is good known practice. Here is another very experienced programmer who does it: Mistigri - Services
He even does not include the source code in standard deal.

There will always be a place for amateur and professional programmers. Our clients base is different.

michal · #**194** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by el cid

We consider our customer’s intellectual property as the most confidential information whereas other coders want to take customer's intellectual property and own the copyrights

Regards

El Cid

If you are referring it to my service then probably you don't understand my copyright sentence correctly. To be clear, the trading algorithm is always a property of my clients and it never becomes my. I never trade my client ideas. However the code which implements the idea can be written in many ways. I developed very powerful template which is already tested in live trading for more than two years. When a client orders an EA with my company he gets this solution above his trading algorithm. I only want to protect my template from spreading by holding the source code copyrights. Clients are free to spread compiled version as it represents their trading algorithm which is theirs. They are not allowed to spread the source code. personally I never met anybody who would like to resell the source anyway. Most clients wants just opposite, protect compiled version from copying by ting it to single account and time limiting it. Therefore I still don't understand why you would like to have source code copyrights? What will it give you which you don't have without copyrights? Please explain.

el cid · #**195** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michal

. Therefore I still don't understand why you would like to have source code copyrights? What will it give you which you don't have without copyrights? Please explain.

It is for my peace of mind.I like to know what is underneath the EX4 files because when things go wrong ,and if the orignal programmers are no longer available ,I can look at source codes and rectify the situation.

I am also risking a lot of money on the EA by using it on a live account ,so I like to have peace of mind when I risk $20k on an EA.

I also tweak orignal MQ4 files and save them in different settings.

There are people like Bluto whose NOLOSS EA is popular and only costs $100 as part of a membership of his group , but I would not use an EA which is only an EX file.It is actually cheaper to buy ready made EX files than to have a new one made.

Don't take my posts as in anyway reflecting on you ,because we have not done any business.

Best regards

El Cid

michal · #**196** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by el cid

It is for my peace of mind.I like to know what is underneath the EX4 files because when things go wrong ,and if the orignal programmers are no longer available ,I can look at source codes and rectify the situation.

You dont need copyrights for this. I ask to contact me before using another programmer just to keep track where my code is going.

Quote:

I am also risking a lot of money on the EA by using it on a live account ,so I like to have peace of mind when I risk $20k on an EA.

How copyright would change it? I relly don't understand your point.

Quote:

I also tweak orignal MQ4 files and save them in different settings.

You don't need copyrights for this.

Quote:

There are people like Bluto whose NOLOSS EA is popular and only costs $100 as part of a membership of his group , but I would not use an EA which is only an EX file.It is actually cheaper to buy ready made EX files than to have a new one made.

What it has to do with the source code copyrights?

Quote:

Don't take my posts as in anyway reflecting on you ,because we have not done any business.

Thank you for claryfing this. IMHO my company offers much more transparancy than many other programmers. You can learn lot about me on my site (even see my foto on Kiva link). I have skype contact with many of my clients, supporting them long time after job is finished. And most of my clients come back to me. I have few ones with more than 10 projects already done. You can even contact some of them and ask for my refferals.

I still don't understand your point of view about source code copyrights.
Nothing which you listed above does need a copyright to be issued.

el cid · #**197** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michal

You dont need copyrights for this. I ask to contact me before using another programmer just to keep track where my code is going.

Hi Michal

Your company provides the MQ4 files and not just EX4 files whilst retaining the copyrights..

The buyer can not issue mq4 files as condition of copyright.

Please confirm

El Cid

michal · #**198** (**permalink**) 10-07-2007, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by el cid

Hi Michal

Your company provides the MQ4 files and not just EX4 files whilst retaining the copyrights..

The buyer can not issue mq4 files as condition of copyright.

Please confirm

El Cid

Yes, a buyer receives the source code.

As condition of copyright the buyer cannot resell the source code (or parts of it) or publish it. He can of course compile it and sell ex4 file without any restrictions. He is also allowed to copy it on his own usage.

el cid · #**199** (**permalink**) 10-10-2007, 12:18 PM

Hi

I think we are looking down on programmers and its not fair.

The smartest thieves are those who claim/pretend to be testers.

The programmer goes through a lot of work to create a E A and making EAS is messy job ,and u simply do not know the amount of effort required behind an E A

The testers on the other hand are the smartes thieves of all.When the E A is ready just claim to be a tester and PM the newbee to help him to test the E A

I am willing to give all my EAS to testers who can prove to me they are honest and genuine.
proof first
El ciD

kjhfdgjfhdghdf · #**200** (**permalink**) 10-10-2007, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by el cid

Hi

I think we are looking down on programmers and its not fair.

The smartest thieves are those who claim/pretend to be testers.

The programmer goes through a lot of work to create a E A and making EAS is messy job ,and u simply do not know the amount of effort required behind an E A

The testers on the other hand are the smartes thieves of all.When the E A is ready just claim to be a tester and PM the newbee to help him to test the E A

I am willing to give all my EAS to testers who can prove to me they are honest and genuine.
proof first
El ciD

I told you ill test it on a LIVE account and am completely dis interested in selling anything.

I just want the EA to make me pips I don't care about anything else.

Secondly QUESTION how much does it cost for a reliable programmer to make API's for MT4 so it receives and uses E-signal data for charts and the EA"s run as normal but with a different feed from E-signal, and sends and receives orders as normal but through an ECN like MBtrading.COST?????